Grove question

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Mountainheart
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Grove question

Post by Mountainheart » 24 Jul 2011, 23:12

I've been going to a certain grove for about five years to spend time with some oak trees and to pray and meditate etc: but recently got a dog which I sometimes take with me.

When I take the dog the atmosphere seems to be different: unwelcoming rather than welcoming.

Does anyone have an idea why that might be?

Thx
David

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Re: Grove question

Post by Idho » 25 Jul 2011, 07:30

Well, I can think of a few things off the top of my head:
Dogs are territorial animals. Your dogs comes from another territory and maybe this is what the environment feels, especially if s/he claims this territory by, uhm, watering against trees and such (I don't know if your dog actually does this, of course).
Also, dogs are hunters. So the energy you're feeling might be the anxiousness of the animals in the grove. Probably, when your dog comes more often they will find that he is no threat and the atmosphere might become less tense.
I don't know if this is a solution, but hopefully it helps :)

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Re: Grove question

Post by bookishepona » 25 Jul 2011, 09:28

As well as the grove itself and the animals there, you could be reacting to the change in circumstances. I don't know how recently you got the dog, or whether it's well behaved or not, or whether it's happy to sit down quietly by you or runs around while you are trying to meditate, but perhaps one of those factors changes the quality of the experience for you? Just a thought.
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Re: Grove question

Post by Mountainheart » 25 Jul 2011, 10:46

Thanks for both your comments. There's no doubt that the dog can be distracting: it's only four months old and full of puppy energy :-)

However I think it's more than that: if I go by myself I walk into the grove and immediately feel safe and welcome. If I take the dog its like walking into a completely different place: not threatening but not welcoming either. This might sound daft; but it feels like there is an atmosphere of jealousy.

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David

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Re: Grove question

Post by treegod » 26 Jul 2011, 08:50

My experience is that dogs can be distracting. If I am not feeling centred then the "energies" of a place can and do feel different to me. Sometimes I could get annoyed at a dog I had, and that would really destroy the atmosphere of the place, at least in terms of my perception of it.

Jealousy? For an ecosystem it sounds a bit weird. I mean, ecosystems are about connections and aren't about exclusive relationships.

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Re: Grove question

Post by skydove » 26 Jul 2011, 09:07

I agree with Treegod on dogs proving a distraction to inner work, particularly with a puppy who is so into everything. Speaking from years of dog walking you have always got to be on the alert for what they are doing. Maybe ease off on your expectations for a bit whilst your dog is so young, and concentrate on developing a relationship with him rather than your grove at the moment, animals can teach us a great deal- its another area for you to study. When you are both ready and know each other a great deal more perhaps then you could introduce him more to your grove and see what happens then.
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Re: Grove question

Post by merryb » 26 Jul 2011, 09:21

When I first got Poppy my dog I would go to my grove, my allotment and found that it was no longer the peaceful haven where I would meditate and connect to the earth. She had a cruel beginning of her life.was very naughty and had a high pitched bark which echoed round the allotments, some people came to complain about her barking, others would come in to give her a hug so my peace disappeared. At times I felt like crying. But gradually as our relationship grew she settled and now she loves the grove. She is interested in the living things around her and she often draws my attention to a kestrel overhead or to inscets buzzing by. Now she enhances my meditation by her presence as she lays beside me and looks so content and at peace.

Having a dog changes our lives we have to take them for walks, which sometimes is wonderful but on a wet night it can be the last thing we want to do. o
OnceI go out I find I enjoy it. I am more aware of sunsets and the phases of the moon . Poppy does not get up until about 8.m. So we miss sunrises.


Is your dog a rescue dog? - Your dog will change things but I hope eventually you both will find the peace and contentment in your grove restored and enhanced.

What kind of dog is she/he and what is the dogs name?

With blessing
Merryb

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Re: Grove question

Post by Mountainheart » 26 Jul 2011, 16:19

merryb wrote:
Is your dog a rescue dog? - Your dog will change things but I hope eventually you both will find the peace and contentment in your grove restored and enhanced.

What kind of dog is she/he and what is the dogs name?

With blessing
Merryb
Dog is a border collie - lakeland terrier cross: so is very intelligent and full of energy.I plan to train him as a Mountain Rescue search dog if he grows large enough and has the right attributes. I'm currently getting him used to the idea of searching by hiding things around the house for him to find. Started with food but now progressing to objects. He's very good at it... so looking hopeful.

He's called Harvey: my daughter's choice.

I think I'll just keep him away from the grove for now.

Thx
David

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Re: Grove question

Post by Mountainheart » 26 Jul 2011, 16:20

treegod wrote:Jealousy? For an ecosystem it sounds a bit weird. I mean, ecosystems are about connections and aren't about exclusive relationships.
I don't disagree with you :-)

Thx
David

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Re: Grove question

Post by Mountainheart » 26 Jul 2011, 16:22

skydove wrote:When you are both ready and know each other a great deal more perhaps then you could introduce him more to your grove and see what happens then.
Yes: that's good advice and what I'm going to do.

Thx
David

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Re: Grove question

Post by merryb » 04 Aug 2011, 08:30

Hi

I hope Harvey gets to be a mountain rescue dog> Poppy, my dog, is a border collie fox terrier cross. The combination of breeds makes for a fiesty, intelligent dog, but a wonderful loyal friend.
Please let us know how Harvey and you, and your family get on.
Blessings to Harvey and his new family.
Merryb.

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Re: Grove question

Post by Zylah » 04 Aug 2011, 23:14

I can relate a little bit, David! I have a 9-yr old Belgian Tervuren who is completely disruptive to anything I try to do outdoors. She loves digging, so at first I tried to have her help me dig holes when I was planting something in my grove or my garden, but she did not quite grasp the concept of when to STOP digging the hole, so THAT backfired on me and turned into a series of plant-mauling disasters. :gloomy: She destroyed my favorite rosemary bush, and I actually cried. My husband calls her our anti-Druid companion. :???:

It's not her fault, and I know it; she doesn't understand why on earth I want to do anything so foolish as digging a lovely hole only to stick something in it and fill it back up. :shrug:

So if I want to meditate or have any sense of peace outdoors, I leave her inside. I adore Mirra, but trying to do anything outside with her other than focus on her leads me very quickly from this :cloud9: to this :x , which is NOT conducive to introspection or peace!

On the other hand, Mirra is really fabulous about my meditation times indoors. She seems to understand the concept of a circle, and stays very quietly next to me or across from me; if she moves around, she does so unobtrusively around the circumference. She has never knocked anything over when I've done ritual indoors, and she actually adds a dimension to the whole experience which is very special.

Dogs are individuals, so I don't know if the same will go for yours, but you may want to see how your dog does in different situations, if you're inclined to want him to be a part of your ritual or meditation times. :)
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Re: Grove question

Post by Huathe » 05 Aug 2011, 05:32

dhonour wrote:I've been going to a certain grove for about five years to spend time with some oak trees and to pray and meditate etc: but recently got a dog which I sometimes take with me.

When I take the dog the atmosphere seems to be different: unwelcoming rather than welcoming.

Does anyone have an idea why that might be?

Thx
David

I remember hiking with my family when I was young, back in the 1970's. Back then you rarely seen people take their dogs on hikes. One exception was hunting dogs. Dad had a couple of beagles he used for rabbit hunting. Back then, most people left their dogs at home or at most rode them around in cars on short trips from home. Now people take their dogs everywhere. Many hotels have even became pet friendly. People tend to treat dogs less like dogs and more like people with four legs.

Personally, I find dogs annoying on hikes. They are noisy and distracting and inhibit my ability so sense a place. I go to the woods for peace and quiet to commune with nature and dogs simply make that difficult for me. If I had a dog I would leave it at home when I headed for the forest.

I have also read of problems that the United States Forest Service has had concerning increased dog traffic on trails. Fights between peoples dogs coming in close proximity on trails has become a problem as well as some people getting bitten. Also doggy-doo is an issue. People are asked to bring a bag to scoop poop but most rarely do. It is actually a law.

My advice to anyone. If you wanna get the most of a woodland experience than leave your dogs at home! And there are others that will appreciate it!
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Re: Grove question

Post by deepwater » 18 Oct 2011, 02:52

I found this odd in I had 2 dogs,,One 4 and the other a puppy,, both enjoyed the grove I visit and loved sitting on the rock ledges,, The grove was very sad when Ben was put to sleep and allowed me to place some of his earth and a toy in her cliff,,Sam feels right at home in the grove and often sleeps as I sit,,She seems to like having him around,,he is quiet and very calm
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Re: Grove question

Post by Mountainheart » 18 Oct 2011, 07:47

deepwater wrote:I found this odd in I had 2 dogs,,One 4 and the other a puppy,, both enjoyed the grove I visit and loved sitting on the rock ledges,, The grove was very sad when Ben was put to sleep and allowed me to place some of his earth and a toy in her cliff,,Sam feels right at home in the grove and often sleeps as I sit,,She seems to like having him around,,he is quiet and very calm
I've solved the issue by letting the dog help find a new grove! We've found a spot where we are both comfortable : -) and I visit the other place by myself when I can.

Thx
David

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Re: Grove question

Post by Mountainheart » 18 Oct 2011, 07:54

merryb wrote:Hi

I hope Harvey gets to be a mountain rescue dog> Poppy, my dog, is a border collie fox terrier cross. The combination of breeds makes for a fiesty, intelligent dog, but a wonderful loyal friend.
Please let us know how Harvey and you, and your family get on.
Blessings to Harvey and his new family.
Merryb.
Thanks Merryb : he is shaping up well but won't really know whether he will be able to train as a search and rescue dog for another year. He needs to be absolutely bullet-proof where it comes to sheep etc as well as knowing not to chase off after rabbits, squirrels etc

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Re: Grove question

Post by Bracken » 18 Oct 2011, 07:59

I think you provided your own answer in a way when you said 'jealousy'. I'd meditate on that if I were you; what it means to you, what part it has played in your life.

I've got a cat. It doesn't matter where she is or what she is doing when I go to meditate, within a minute she is climbing all over me. She finds a comfy place somewhere on my body and purrs really loud then falls asleep. :D
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Re: Grove question

Post by Mountainheart » 18 Oct 2011, 08:05

Bracken wrote:I think you provided your own answer in a way when you said 'jealousy'. I'd meditate on that if I were you; what it means to you, what part it has played in your life.
Hi Bracken: not 100% sure what you mean; are you able to elaborate a bit? :)

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David

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Re: Grove question

Post by Bracken » 18 Oct 2011, 11:39

Sure. I was just wondering if you felt the grove was jealous because it was actually jealous, or if your psyche's kicking in with the thing you need right now to take the next step on your journey.

I think that's how our meditations work for us sometimes. Subconscious imagery gives us clues. For example, if I'm doing a tarot reading for myself I might pick a card and it will have a certain meaning. The next month, same card, totally different meaning. The card hasn't changed. What is different is my internal makeup. The meaning is coming from inside me. The fact that you fealt jealousy from the grove might be coming from inside you for some reason that only you can understand.

I suppose I was just saying that it might be an interesting idea to give space to for a time. See if it has something to say. I mean, it's a very powerful emotion, isn't it?
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Re: Grove question

Post by Mountainheart » 18 Oct 2011, 11:51

Bracken wrote:Sure. I was just wondering if you felt the grove was jealous because it was actually jealous, or if your psyche's kicking in with the thing you need right now to take the next step on your journey.

I think that's how our meditations work for us sometimes. Subconscious imagery gives us clues. For example, if I'm doing a tarot reading for myself I might pick a card and it will have a certain meaning. The next month, same card, totally different meaning. The card hasn't changed. What is different is my internal makeup. The meaning is coming from inside me. The fact that you fealt jealousy from the grove might be coming from inside you for some reason that only you can understand.

I suppose I was just saying that it might be an interesting idea to give space to for a time. See if it has something to say. I mean, it's a very powerful emotion, isn't it?
Thanks Bracken: that's very helpful. Totally agree with what you say about subconscious imagery. I will have a ponder :)

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