Only Shamans?

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ravenfolk
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Only Shamans?

Post by ravenfolk » 16 Jun 2010, 00:23

There is certianly alot of interesting reading here on this forum. I know a little about shamanism :roll: , from what I have read and such ...my question is it possible for people who are not shamans to travel into the otherworld? What if the otherside just opens up to you right where you are and you weren't even trying...????? :???:

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Re: Only Shamans?

Post by treegod » 16 Jun 2010, 08:07

Difficult to answer I think because "shaman" comes from a Siberian word for a particular tribal function, and many cultures have an approximate version that anthropologists generalise as "shamans."

However they can differ from culture to culture, so some cultures recognise that only shamans can travel to the otherworld and other cultures may give a little leeway to its non-shamanic members.

Not knowing much about shamanic cultures I can't really say what cultures practice what and the relationship between tribe and otherworld and the role the shaman plays within each. Plenty of other minds around here though :D

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Re: Only Shamans?

Post by Astrid » 16 Jun 2010, 08:50

with out knowing anything about shamans i'll give my 5 cents

From my perspective anyone can enter the otherworld - from a druidic point of view at least

wheter one can do it with out trying im not entirely sure - but i think you might just as you can wander into the world of the fey by accisent :D
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Re: Only Shamans?

Post by Corwen » 16 Jun 2010, 09:32

In some cultures the journeying is all done by a single specialist, in others everyone does it.
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Re: Only Shamans?

Post by Explorer » 16 Jun 2010, 15:21

Try to look beyond the labels, 'shaman' is just a term. Try to grasp what it means instead of trying to find a definition.

What we call "journey into the otherworld" is a state-of-mind, a sort of waking dream state, using imagination and visualisation, also called 'trance' (another confusing term). You can reach this state through different methods, in different forms and in different intensities. Meditation, drumming, chanting, dancing, sex, pain, fatigue, hunger, drugs. And it may not surprise you that gentle meditation in a peaceful forest brings you somewhere else than a trip on poisonous fly agaric mushrooms for instance.

The results that you get do not only depend on the form and intensity, not just on the images and experiences in that trance, but mostly on what meaning you give to it. Which depends on your culture, or in our case, on our training in the 'mystery school' we call OBOD.

So, yes, you can also "journey into the otherworld". But it only gets meaning if you can weave your experiences there into the tapestry of your life.
OBOD training is a bit weak when it comes to the intensity of that trance, but pretty strong in creating the tapestry in which to embed these experiences.
At least this is my opinion about it.
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Re: Only Shamans?

Post by Corwen » 16 Jun 2010, 19:50

good post Mr E.
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Re: Only Shamans?

Post by ravenfolk » 17 Jun 2010, 00:32

Great responses, thanks for giving me a better understanding. As you have probably guessed I am not a shaman. I am trying to gain some understanding of an experience I had at work. I was just strolling down the hallway and I stepped into...someplace? There were lights or maybe stars passing by me and just as easily as I stepped into this place I stepped right out again. What was this...????

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Re: Only Shamans?

Post by Explorer » 17 Jun 2010, 07:37

ravenfolk wrote:Great responses, thanks for giving me a better understanding. As you have probably guessed I am not a shaman. I am trying to gain some understanding of an experience I had at work. I was just strolling down the hallway and I stepped into...someplace? There were lights or maybe stars passing by me and just as easily as I stepped into this place I stepped right out again. What was this...????

ravenfolk
A little short circuit in your brain? Did you bump your head? Did you take a specific substance just before?
I'm not joking, our brain is the organ that we use to perceive these realities. (I'm not going into the debate whether they exist outside us or not, that is not relevant).

It might even have been a subconscious kick in the butt, our minds are strange things. Did it mean anything to you? Apparently it did, otherwise you wouldn't be asking around on a druid forum. And seen from that perspective you could even see it as a short visit to the 'otherworld', perhaps a message (from yourself?) to set you on a certain track, like druidry ;-). And 10 years from now you may look back and see this experience as a defining moment. I have some defining moments like that also.

But what it really was depends on the meaning you give to it.
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Re: Only Shamans?

Post by treegod » 17 Jun 2010, 08:28

Another good post Explorer.

Especially that last sentence :)

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Re: Only Shamans?

Post by Explorer » 17 Jun 2010, 08:31

treegod wrote:Another good post Explorer.

Especially that last sentence :)
Thank you Corwen and Treegod. :tiphat:
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Re: Only Shamans?

Post by ravenfolk » 17 Jun 2010, 15:43

"But what it really was depends on the meaning you give to it.[/quote]"

I love the honesty and straight forwardness of your reply! :D As for the brain injuries or altaration, :blink: nope, I was just doing my work and walking from one place to another. It did mean a great deal to me. It was, I guess a conformation of sorts. I saw it as a spiritual experience. It was't an event that started me on my path but it defenitly contributes to the understanding of my path. I have been drawn to druidry on and off now over the past 2 years. I have felt an ancestral connection to it and I feel a connection to nature as well. I figure asking questions and taking small steps is a good way to start my path into druidry. You just never know what will happen along the way... :wid:

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Re: Only Shamans?

Post by Donata » 17 Jun 2010, 16:00

Explorer has given excellent responses, and I agree with him. Skip the labels. As mentioned, 'shaman' is a term that has been appropriated for generic use of techniques that seem to be common to shamans, medicine people and others worldwide. The OBOD course used guided meditations that may become journeys. The process is common, can be practiced by a group or as a solitary.

I'll add, now that you've experienced slipping into the otherworlds, you may choose to examine how others do it. Most shamans, medicine people, other, including OBOD members, have a set procedure. Mostly this will include cleansing of self - such as smudging - creating sacred space, calling in Guide/s, setting an intention. Your Guide is there to help you and to protect you should that be needed. Having a way to end the journey is a good idea. If you do this alone a tape or CD can be useful. Set the intention that you will return from your journey when the tape or CD ends. I find most CDs may be too long, so you may wish to tape part of one, or start it closer to the end.

Good luck!
Donata

FYI:
'Shaman' comes from the language of the Tungus of North-Central Asia. It came into use in English via Russian.
http://stason.org/TULARC/new-age/shaman ... haman.html

Another site states:
The word shaman, used internationally, has its origin in manchú-tangu and has reached the ethnologic vocabulary through Russian. The word originated from saman (xaman), derived from the verb scha-, "to know", so shaman means someone who knows, is wise, a sage. Further ethnologic investigations shows that the true origin for the word Shaman can be tracked from the Sanskrit initially, then through Chinese-Buddhist mediation to the manchú-tangu, indicating a much deeper but now overlooked connection between early Buddhism and Shamanism generally. In Pali it is schamana, in Sanskrit sramana translated to something like "buddhist monk, ascetic". The intermediate Chinese term is scha-men.
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Re: Only Shamans?

Post by ravenfolk » 17 Jun 2010, 19:27

[quote="Donata"]Explorer has given excellent responses, and I agree with him. Skip the labels. As mentioned, 'shaman' is a term that has been appropriated for generic use of techniques that seem to be common to shamans, medicine people and others worldwide. The OBOD course used guided meditations that may become journeys. The process is common, can be practiced by a group or as a solitary.

I'll add, now that you've experienced slipping into the otherworlds, you may choose to examine how others do it. Most shamans, medicine people, other, including OBOD members, have a set procedure. Mostly this will include cleansing of self - such as smudging - creating sacred space, calling in Guide/s, setting an intention. Your Guide is there to help you and to protect you should that be needed. Having a way to end the journey is a good idea. If you do this alone a tape or CD can be useful. Set the intention that you will return from your journey when the tape or CD ends. I find most CDs may be too long, so you may wish to tape part of one, or start it closer to the end.



Good luck!
Donata

Thanks! Everyone has been so helpful... :)

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Re: Only Shamans?

Post by Davin Raincloud » 19 Oct 2010, 00:05

All creativity and higher things come from the otherworld.

So a Bard, an Artist or musician is constantly drawing on or invoking the otherworld....and it is like a journey.

In terms of spiritual journeying, this cna happen for all beings who have spirit.

A shaman is just a specialist in that, and a spiritual healer.
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Re: Only Shamans?

Post by Fox of the Oaks » 19 Oct 2010, 01:51

Nico wrote: OBOD training is a bit weak when it comes to the intensity of that trance, but pretty strong in creating the tapestry in which to embed these experiences.
It's probably a good thing so we don't have people new to such things entering too deep with little direct support in coming out of them and integrating all the material (particularly for those of us so far from Albion and its many Druids.)

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