USA: GOP & Climate Change

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DJ Droood
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Re: USA: GOP & Climate Change

Postby DJ Droood » 21 Jun 2011, 17:22

Not really that that surprising...there is a *lot* of money being pumped into disinformation....the same tactics were used by the tobacco companies...flood media with conflicting and confusing accounts, create a few scandals ("Climategate"), make it about domestic party politics, use strawmen (Al Gore), demonize "environmentalist" and "tree huggers", label them as "socialists" ...add in the fact that the majority of people don't have the scientific education (myself included) to parse the information for themselves, and a sense of helplessness and it is easier just to ignore/deny. It is all very esoteric anyway...you can't really hear, see, smell, taste or touch "climate change"...it is still cold in the winter and hot in the summer....and nobody is going to give up their car or stop eating fried meat at every meal! That is crazy talk!
BP and several other big European companies are funding the midterm election campaigns of Tea Party favourites who deny the existence of global warming or oppose Barack Obama’s energy agenda, the Guardian has learned.

An analysis of campaign finance by Climate Action Network Europe (Cane) found nearly 80% of campaign donations from a number of major European firms were directed towards senators who blocked action on climate change. These included incumbents who have been embraced by the Tea Party such as Jim DeMint, a Republican from South Carolina, and the notorious climate change denier James Inhofe, a Republican from Oklahoma.
http://www.disinfo.com/2010/10/tea-part ... polluters/


Just turn on any corporate talk radio station anywhere in the Western world, any day of the week and you will hear the host railing against climate change tofu-eaters, etc.
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Re: USA: GOP & Climate Change

Postby Arcanum » 27 Jun 2011, 07:27

I think it should be said, scientific method does not prove anything, it can only disprove.

Thus anyone (politician, talking head, PhD, or Druid for that matter) claiming Climate change has been proven, I would view very critically, because it has not.

The American Physical Society as flipped-flopped over the years on what their official statement has been.. Here is some a good rundown of the data so far:
"In the final analysis, the difference between CAGW alarmists and CAGW skeptics is that an alarmists believes the climate system has a gain of 1 and 11% positive feedback, while the skeptics believe that the climate system has a gain of about 1.4 and about 18% negative feedback."
So climate change is hardly "proven" - (but it has not been disproved!). So... what do do in the meantime? How bout we spend our time, money and energy to help balance things we know are out of balance, such as smog, polution and helping yourself and others live in more tune with Earth *gasp* locally?

Just a thought.


What do I think? I think climate change is a result of change in axial tilt, and had a divination that the magnetic field of Earth cycles (it has been proven already), and after so many cycles the Earth will give birth to another moon and look something like Mars in around 20,000 years, (And Mars will look like the Asteroid belt).
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DJ Droood
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Re: USA: GOP & Climate Change

Postby DJ Droood » 27 Jun 2011, 11:26

What do I think? I think climate change is a result of change in axial tilt, and had a divination that the magnetic field of Earth cycles (it has been proven already), and after so many cycles the Earth will give birth to another moon and look something like Mars in around 20,000 years, (And Mars will look like the Asteroid belt).
I think you should be a GOP speech writer!

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Re: USA: GOP & Climate Change

Postby Davin Raincloud » 28 Jun 2011, 09:01

Guys, guys, guys.....

You don't see it do you??

The GOP is for active measures to counter climate change and they have always believed in it.

In fact they are fighting the Democrats who are climate deniers.

Bah! I guess you won't see it until 20 years in the future when we've been forced to do something, the change goes through...and the Republicans can finally tell you:

They were for it all along!

Just like the Gay rights thing, and of course the civil rights thing.

The Beauty is, you don't realise how awesome they are, until it's time re-write history! :yay:

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Re: USA: GOP & Climate Change

Postby Michael C. Page » 28 Jun 2011, 16:48

And come election time we will hear this great song:

Down with them,
Up with us,
Haza haza haza!

Don’t believe them,
Believe in us,
Haza haza haza.

We’re the best of the worst of the rest
Haza haza haza!

Believe our Pro-pa-gandaaaaaaaaa
Hazaaaaaaaaaaaa!

2nd verse:

They have plans which are filled with Bile!
Haza haza haza!

So join our parade and shout Sig Heil!
Haza haza haza

Give us your money and walk the green mile!
Haza haza haza!

Believe our Pro-pa-gandaaaaaaaaa
Hazaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah


:whistle:
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Re: USA: GOP & Climate Change

Postby Aitrus » 28 Jun 2011, 17:00

Hmm, you're right. We do seem to hear that song, from both sides, during every election year. Somebody somewhere must think it's a classic because we keep hearing it all the time, like worn-out Christmas songs that are dusted off every year.
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Re: USA: GOP & Climate Change

Postby DJ Droood » 28 Jun 2011, 17:12

And come election time we will hear this great song
that's right, because everyone knows that "climate change" is just another parochial issue like the tax rate...a football for the politicians to throw around while the rest of us sit in the stands or watch on TV....and if we get bored, we can change the channel...what is the worse that can happen?
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Re: USA: GOP & Climate Change

Postby Aitrus » 28 Jun 2011, 17:18

what is the worse that can happen?
To fall under the sway of any media- or government-backed viewpoint without thinking about it, researching it, thinking about it some more, then making our decision on the issue based on our personal morals, attitudes, goals and life experiences. I think that those that have hopped on the "climate change" bandwagon without examining the theory are just as bad that have jumped on the "anti climate change" bandwagon without doing the dame.

The worst thing that can happen is to let somebody tell us what to believe.
You may not be able to outrun Death, but you can sure make the Bastard work for it!
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Re: USA: GOP & Climate Change

Postby DJ Droood » 28 Jun 2011, 17:22

The worst thing that can happen is to let somebody tell us what to believe.
and that is just the kind of trick the sneaky socialists would try to pull on us!

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Re: USA: GOP & Climate Change

Postby Aitrus » 28 Jun 2011, 18:31

The worst thing that can happen is to let somebody tell us what to believe.
and that is just the kind of trick the sneaky socialists would try to pull on us!
Those hypocritical conservatives as well! Darn it all, there's no living with any of em! :-)
You may not be able to outrun Death, but you can sure make the Bastard work for it!
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Re: USA: GOP & Climate Change

Postby Michael C. Page » 30 Jun 2011, 00:34

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"If a man does not keep pace with his companions,
perhaps it is because he hears a different drummer.
Let him step to the music he hears,
however measured or far away."
- Thoreau

My harp was sacrificed to the Honorable Snarg.

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Re: USA: GOP & Climate Change

Postby DJ Droood » 30 Jun 2011, 01:29

Gawd bless the people who think voting for the right party and riding a bike will stop global warming....their hearts are in the right place. I am not convinced, although I think voting for the correct party and riding a bike are good things to do for numerous other reasons. :cycle:
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Re: USA: GOP & Climate Change

Postby Michael C. Page » 30 Jun 2011, 14:44

Gawd bless the people who think voting for the right party and riding a bike will stop global warming....their hearts are in the right place. I am not convinced, although I think voting for the correct party and riding a bike are good things to do for numerous other reasons. :cycle:
I’m personally convinced that neither the Dems nor the Reps care about the greater welfare of the country. I think they just want to keep the USA bipolar so they can stay in power. It seems to be a game to them and I don’t think that anyone in political office right now cares about anything but themselves. I hate to sound cynical. It’s all smoke and mirrors and behind the scenes they’re laughing about the con job they’re pulling…..and I really think that when they get caught they just laugh harder.

Boy! Where the heck did that come from…..I’m normally so cheerful… :blink:
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Re: USA: GOP & Climate Change

Postby DJ Droood » 30 Jun 2011, 15:01

Boy! Where the heck did that come from…..I’m normally so cheerful… :blink:

yea..."cynicism" and "negativity" (often confused with "realism" and "rationality") are the modern Cardinal Sins....must...keep....positive....must ...keep.. smiling.....oh, and "find solutions" and "not be part of the problem"...and...."be the change you want in the world" and all that stuff that makes Oprah and the Dalai Lama so inspirational.

Personally, I embrace dissociation, and try to remain cheerful and positive in the small worlds where I have some control (mostly my office in the basement) and ignore everything else that is scary and out of my control...meteors and climate change, civilization imploding back into a Dark Age of superstition and ignorance, etc.etc.
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Re: USA: GOP & Climate Change

Postby Merlyn » 26 Jul 2011, 14:00

http://www.npr.org/2011/07/25/138618336 ... ay-past-93

We indeed seem to have a dysfunctional party system when it comes to solving problems that don't feed money into the pockets of DC politicians.
The GOP sees this issues very differently from the Democrats.
"When the oil runs out the problem will $elf resolve" : GOP
"We need to tax tax tax all that oil before it runs out" : Democrats

Meanwhile: Keep 'em running in the hamster wheel with a phony recession and 0% interest that no one can have.....

Seems however the troubles are coming full cycle and the $$$ are running short...

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Re: USA: GOP & Climate Change

Postby Merlyn » 09 Aug 2011, 19:24

Dysfunction has caused so much trouble in itself lately, seems the political parties cannot get it together, and in fact drive issues to the wire.
Doing so with pollution, the economy, global warming and things of the sort is playing with fire and irresponsible.
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Re: USA: GOP & Climate Change

Postby dvawlqos » 15 Aug 2011, 16:39

http://www.npr.org/2011/06/21/137298152 ... -non-issue

"Republican candidates aren't the only ones who have changed their tune in recent years. The Pew Research Center points to a sharp decline in the number of Americans who even believe that global warming is happening, let alone that it's a serious problem."

:gloomy:
Part of the problem is that people are very concerned about jobs. So they're much more concerned with economics than environmental concerns. I tend to agree -- not that the environment is not important, but that it should take a backseat to issues of human survival, and without jobs the people and the nation starve. I think investing in more eco-friendly techs might be a boon on both fronts, but I also think that imposing such things from the top down would be unlikely to solve either problem. We DO need a culture change toward more efficient living, but jobs will always be closest to the people's heart.
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Re: USA: GOP & Climate Change

Postby wolf5051 » 09 Jan 2013, 04:46

I live in Colorado, ladies and gentlemen I wore a short sleeve shirt to christmas. This does not happen here. It has been worse and worse every year and its not just affecting our environment but our economy. Rafting companies, ski companies, winter and summer ecotourism has declined severely. I wish I could say I dont see the signs but I do. Anyone who wants to have a deeper discussion about the science involved here I have a masters in biology, bachelors in biology and chemistry. However, the bottom line is the environment does release these gasses naturally but we have accelerated it significantly and the system is out of balance. We need to seek balance in all things especially as druids. We are taught to think in threes not twos, binary thinking meaning it is good or it is evil this is discouraged....so we need to look to the middle ground the third piece moderation. Can we use clean technology to balance our use of hydrocarbons? The answer is there for those who will open their eyes.

I propose we take this out of the perspective of politics however! GOP or Democrat another binary if you believe one then the other is evil. This issue needs to be non-partisan. Can we instead view it as a scientific theory and treat it as such. I believe if confronted with the science without the politics if both sides removed this from their war chest and instead put it in the collaborative middle of the road pile we could come to some better solutions.

Lets collaborate as druids instead of GOP or DEM!

With hope for middle ground,


Jason


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