Reclamation of the idea of "Faith"

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echoe
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Re: Reclamation of the idea of "Faith"

Post by echoe » 20 Dec 2010, 22:09

It's called a really great book in the making!

Trust is involved in faith, IMHO. Belief is involved in faith. It's hard to untangle all of those concepts, many other words work that way also. Or should I say "too? As well?" Faith isn't necessarily based on a phenomena not seen or understood. It can also be based upon a history of facts as well. I have faith that there will be a tomorrow, because there have been many of them for thousands of years. I can't be guaranteed a tomorrow, but I'm not too darned worried about it. And that involves trust and belief.

Having faith in another person's word usually involves knowing the person well enough to be able to believe what they're saying, or if a first-time meeting, for the most part, some of us give the benefit of the doubt (faith) until or unless proven otherwise, that depending on the risks required or asked.

Faith isn't necessarily sheer hope without basis. (Indiana Jones when he stepped out onto the "air" while he couldn't see the platform, had been shown repeatedly that his writings and learnings had proven stable, so he had reason to trust that what he couldn't see, would turn out to be as stable.) But faith may make us take a bigger risk than we normally would in life. How many gamblers have faith that the NEXT one will be the big winner? How many huge successful entrepreneurs would have made it without faith?

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Re: Reclamation of the idea of "Faith"

Post by wolf560 » 20 Dec 2010, 23:20

echoe wrote:Trust is involved in faith, IMHO. Belief is involved in faith.
I agree... my point was that the idea of "FAith" had somehow become entangled in the religious aspect and perhaps it should not be so entwined anymore.

Perhaps we can say there is "Faith", "Blind Faith", and "Good Faith"...

Faith- the belief in something without proof to the contrary
Blind Faith- the belief in something DESPITE of all proof to the contrary
Good Faith- the belief in something BECAUSE of some proof to the point
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Re: Reclamation of the idea of "Faith"

Post by DJ Droood » 21 Dec 2010, 00:04

echoe wrote:How many gamblers have faith that the NEXT one will be the big winner?
Lots! And how many have blown their kid's college money on that faith...waaaaay more than have won the "jackpot"....and in the end, it was all probability, chance and odds, for both the winners and the losers...or maybe you are right...there is a divine being who answers a few gambler's prayers and ruins many other lives, for mysterious reasons we can never understand...if so, He seems to be a jack-wagon.
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wolf560
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Re: Reclamation of the idea of "Faith"

Post by wolf560 » 21 Dec 2010, 01:41

DJ Droood wrote:
echoe wrote:How many gamblers have faith that the NEXT one will be the big winner?
...there is a divine being who answers a few gambler's prayers and ruins many other lives...
...and that would be "the balance of life" in action...

For every action there is an equal yet opposite reaction;
For every winner in the balance
another losing at a game of chance
For every game played openly at least one played unseen by most


What people do not factor into the "winner -vs- loser equation" is "The House". The house is a "player" but with a far better chance at winning since it controls the parameters of the game. In the end there will be a lot more players as losers due to the house occupying a larger share of the winners... It is not a "one for one" amongst the players but overall.

That's why many of the more professional gamblers say that the "odds are better" at certain games such as poker when you are playing against the house.
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Melhael
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Re: Reclamation of the idea of "Faith"

Post by Melhael » 22 Dec 2010, 18:47

wolf560 wrote:Faith- the belief in something without proof to the contrary
Blind Faith- the belief in something DESPITE of all proof to the contrary
Good Faith- the belief in something BECAUSE of some proof to the point[/i]
:applause:

Interestingly in French both "faith" and "good faith" use the word "foi" (and "bonne foi"), but "blind faith" is translated "confiance aveugle" ("blind trust", literally).

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Re: Reclamation of the idea of "Faith"

Post by echoe » 23 Dec 2010, 10:50

Avez vous habitait la France? J'admet de ne pas avait eu la chance d'entendre une otre dire "confiance aveugle"... Mais, J'ait entendu "mal foi," (bad faith.) (le nom du sinistre fils dans la serie d'Harry Potter.)

J'aimerai bien parler en francais encore. Mais bon... si non, c'est non. MDR

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Re: Reclamation of the idea of "Faith"

Post by Melhael » 23 Dec 2010, 12:12

D'ailleurs est-ce qu'on dit "bad faith" en anglais ? :thinking:

(Sinon, je ne suis pas Français. Je suis Belge francophone. ;)) And enough with French. We wouldn't want to be rude to the rest of the people around here. ;) (I promise, we didn't say anything bad... if you don't speak French, though, you sort of have to take that... on faith. :D)

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Re: Reclamation of the idea of "Faith"

Post by treegod » 23 Dec 2010, 12:35

Melhael wrote:D'ailleurs est-ce qu'on dit "bad faith" en anglais ? :thinking:

(Sinon, je ne suis pas Français. Je suis Belge francophone. ;)) And enough with French. We wouldn't want to be rude to the rest of the people around here. ;) (I promise, we didn't say anything bad... if you don't speak French, though, you sort of have to take that... on faith. :D)
Being semi-monolingual...

I didn't find it rude. And if anyone did, they should get used to the idea that hay mas que Inglés en el mundo ;)

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Re: Reclamation of the idea of "Faith"

Post by echoe » 23 Dec 2010, 13:18

un million gracias! No rudeness intended. I know this site does have other languages included. Thanks for helping me out!

I suppose we do use the term bad faith in English. Not often, but from time to time. There is more of a focus on good faith. Or maybe I'm just too tired to think and need to head off to sleep.

Belgium is very beautiful! I'd love to visit someday, but for now, I'm stuck in the U.S. I miss France terribly. and I apologize also for my written french, it's horrible, but that comes from not learning in France during my younger years, only my older years. Passez une Bonne journee!

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Re: Reclamation of the idea of "Faith"

Post by wolf560 » 23 Dec 2010, 15:02

Use of different languages is :shake:
Machts nichts, Hamdullah Habibe, Kadam Muskil Niest, de Nada Muchachas, Mafi Mushkilla

"No Problem" in most of the phrases above but contextually accepted by at least the day to day people as "no problem" (Hamdullah is actually "It's OK", and de Nada is actually "It'd nothing")
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