Rationally Irrational

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Rationally Irrational

Post by treegod » 28 Apr 2013, 19:12

I thought I'd share this collection of Carl Jung quotes here. I think the subject below is the reason many of us are "sceptical druids" and not just "sceptics", that we somehow combine the rational and irrational together:

"Primitive superstition lies just below the surface of even the most tough-minded individuals, and it is precisely those who most fight against it who are the first to succumb to its suggestive effects."

"You can take away a man's gods, but only to give him others in return."

"Reason alone does not suffice."

"The conscious mind allows itself to be trained like a parrot, but the unconscious does not — which is why St. Augustine thanked God for not making him responsible for his dreams."

"Because we cannot discover God's throne in the sky with a radiotelescope or establish (for certain) that a beloved father or mother is still about in a more or less corporeal form, people assume that such ideas are "not true." I would rather say that they are not "true" enough, for these are conceptions of a kind that have accompanied human life from prehistoric times, and that still break through into consciousness at any provocation."

"Modern man may assert that he can dispense with them, and he may bolster his opinion by insisting that there is no scientific evidence of their truth. But since we are dealing with invisible and unknowable things (for God is beyond human understanding, and there is no mean of proving immortality), why should we bother with evidence?"

"We should not pretend to understand the world only by the intellect; we apprehend it just as much by feeling. Therefore, the judgement of the intellect is, at best, only the half of truth, and must, if it be honest, also come to an understanding of its inadequacy."

"Every civilized human being, whatever his conscious development, is still an archaic man at the deeper levels of his psyche. Just as the human body connects us with the mammals and displays numerous relics of earlier evolutionary stages going back to even the reptilian age, so the human psyche is likewise a product of evolution which, when followed up to its origins, show countless archaic traits."

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Re: Rationally Irrational

Post by Heddwen » 28 Apr 2013, 19:27

Hi Treegod, interesting quotes. I always wondered how it worked!

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Re: Rationally Irrational

Post by Explorer » 29 Apr 2013, 08:12

good post Treegod.

I spend half my time arguing against silly assumptions from both extremes of dualistic thinking, from both the rational and the irrational extremes.
Not 'silly' because they are 'not true', but 'silly' because people say things that they cannot possibly know. (and sometimes things that are plainly very dumb and uneducated).

Statements like 'gods do not exist' and 'we are visited by aliens' are just as silly, made by people who lack a sense of distinction between the rational and irrational, and who lack the understanding how bloody important both those domains are for our human welfare and well being. In my humble opinion ofcourse ;-)

I am an atheist, but I won't say that gods don't exist (the first questions would then be 'define gods... define existing'). I don't believe in anything supernatural either, but my life is shaped by magic. I want to be firmly rooted in the rational, but also in the irrational, otherwise it feels like I am missing a limb.

So I spend the other half of my time being very rational and very irrational :grin:
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence


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Re: Rationally Irrational

Post by Bart » 30 Apr 2013, 19:00

Number of thoughts race through my mind:

Yes we are driven by our physical unconsciousness, which means not only our sub conscious thoughts, but also our bodily sensory system. If our gut starts to feel anxious, our mind get anxious and vice versa.

The human race has been trying to control it's habitat, both by direct action as by magic. Religion might be the ultimate way of trying to control one's fate, who knows.

There are brain structures designed for spirituallity, why?

And for the other side: if you listen to the theories of theoretical physicists, believing in god might be simpler. According to theory the universe should not exist, so why not a divine interference.

I believe in biology, physics and interwoven energy layers making us one. Call me insane, but it works for me.

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Re: Rationally Irrational

Post by JoseeGunville » 04 May 2013, 15:16

I think that faith is a need (not a choice) and we all have it to different extents. Some are happy not believing in much more than the physical world, and that's great. Some people need an explanation to their existence and I feel like religion is there for them for that reason, it makes people more secure and gives them a sense of community, that they are not alone in their faith.

I know for myself I do have a need to believe in something more than just the physical world, and I have decided to not want to be right about anything. I recognize it is a need, I may be right, I may be wrong, but I choose the freedom to believe what I want at any time and then I can change my mind if I want. Because freedom makes me happy, and I want to be happy.

I have faith that existence is vast and magical and beyond anything I could ever hope to comprehend, and it makes life wonderful, and I need to believe that to be happy.



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